From the outside, a family can look picture-perfect, but you never know what is truly going on behind closed doors. Our guest today, Leisse Wilcox, is an amazing example of being the person (or in her case, writing the book) she needed when she was younger. A success coach, podcast host, and cancer survivor, Leisse joins us today to share her journey to discovering who she really is and finding what her normal looks like.
Listen in as she explains why you cannot let other people’s opinions determine your worth and the importance of believing in yourself. You will learn the benefit of following your intuition (your cosmic breadcrumbs) and how to find forgiveness. This is an incredible story of how Leisse turned trauma into beauty, and it is not an episode to be missed!
Listen to the Full Episode:
What You’ll Learn:
Why you never know what’s happening in other people’s lives.
The importance of not letting others’ judgments determine your worth.
Why it is crucial to allow yourself to feel your feelings.
The benefit of following your intuition.
Why we must learn to forgive.
Ideas Worth Sharing:
“Forgiveness is not about setting the other person free or absolving them from behavior. It’s setting yourself free.” - Leisse Wilcox
“When you keep following those little cosmic breadcrumbs, those little bits of intuition, those little hits, and you do what really lights you up, that brings you passion, that feels in line with your purpose, even if you don’t know what that purpose is… it’s generally a good sign that you’re doing the right thing.” - Leisse Wilcox
“Allow yourself to feel your feelings.” - Leisse Wilcox
Resources:
To Call Myself Beloved by Leisse Wilcox
Self Love Holiday Bundle by Leisse Wilcox
EPISODE 05
LEISSE WILCOX
TRANSCRIPT:
*Please note that transcripts are auto-transcribed, they are for reference only and may contain typos*
Molly Dare 0:06
Hello and welcome to the On Air with Molly Dare podcast series. I'm your host Molly Dare, founder of hillenBRAND Media single mother of two and deeply passionate about sharing stories of strength and inspiration in the hopes of inspiring and empowering others to live their best lives. On today's episode, I'm so pleased to have Leisse Wilcox, Master mindset and success coach TEDx speaker, top podcast host, cancer survivor, single mom of three, best selling author, of To Call Myself Beloved: A story of hope, healing and coming home. Welcome, Leisse, thank you so much for joining us today.
Leisse Wilcox 0:45
It is such a pleasure to be here. Thank you so much.
Molly Dare 0:48
I was just saying to you I was lucky enough literally an hour before this podcast, a beautiful box arrived of your amazing Yes, you fucking can bundle. absolute favorite to anybody who is watching the video of this, it comes with all sorts of amazing things. And for anybody who follows me, you know how much I love, you know, quotes and inspirational sayings and cards. And I mean, all the things that you need, especially tissue.
Leisse Wilcox 1:19
It's like the most valuable part.
Molly Dare 1:23
Smart move, I'll try not to use them during this episode. I'll try to keep it positive and a space, safe space. But whatever happens happens. Anyway, I will link also to how anyone can get that bundle as well. So I just want to go straight to your book To Call Myself Beloved. Because Wow, this is jam packed with amazing tidbits. And honestly, it's a book that I can pick up at any day and just go to a specific chapter that relates to whatever the issue is that I'm facing. I love the positive quotes throughout the book, the book starts out talking about the picture perfect life that you had, and how you constantly were filling yourself with more and more stuff, which I think a lot of us are guilty of doing, if you wanted to kind of talk a little bit about that.
Leisse Wilcox 2:15
Oh, yeah, of course. And that was interestingly a pattern that had been repeated from my childhood that we had this like picture, perfect, idyllic looking life from the outside in. And inside. It was an emotional nightmare, like abuse, it was just so uncomfortable. And nobody knew because it was so isolating. And then when I was an adult, I kind of recreated that I had this like beautiful picture perfect lifestyle that looked amazing looking in. And there was this moment when I literally woke up, I spiritually woke up I guess not literally woke I was already physically awake. But I was lying on the floor looking like with my little girls. Looking in my kitchen this like beautifully renovated kitchen in this epic century home. Just looking around at how perfect everything was and and asking myself like, Oh my god, how was this not enough for me? And hearing this little download of a voice saying this is not enough for you? Because you are not enough for you? And that was this kind of gut punching moment of like, Whoa, what would that look like? What would that feel like in order to create that feeling of enoughness that sense of internal validation, I knew I had to make some radical, some dramatic life and lifestyle changes that would allow me to cultivate that independent of anything else around me or anyone else around me. And that's kind of where life 2.0 for me began.
Molly Dare 3:38
I love that you say this. Also, you know, I always love the quote, be the person you needed when you were younger. You wrote the book you always needed when you were younger. It is true. It's the manual.
Leisse Wilcox 3:50
It is and that's what I was looking for was that when I was going through this transition, which definitely include a divorce. And you know, that transition of divorce into singlehood was not just the end of the marriage, it was the end of a family as I knew it was the end of future that I thought I had it was the end of being a stay at home mom and launching myself into becoming like this accidental entrepreneur, it was so much changed my social dynamic social circles, those dynamics changed, everything changed, and it felt like this snow globe that I just shook up with my life. And then it took me a good few years to like let all the pieces settle into place and figure out what normal looks like and felt like and who I was really at my core. And during that process. I couldn't believe it but there was no guidebook or no process to like help me through that. And so for me, this is a self love Manifesto. It is a compendium of everything I learned it's probably worth about $120,000 invested into like figuring it all out. And I wrote this like 400 page book on exactly how like not only meaning and talking about Yeah, just love yourself. Take care of yourself. Like become enough. Like, no, this is literally how you do it step by step.
Molly Dare 5:04
It is and I, you know, I was saying to you before we started recording that it's a great book that you can jump back to. And once you've read it, which is great, and you can use so much, but you can also go back to it and refer to it if you're if you're running into a problem. And you're like, whatever, there's certain chapters that you just, you need that reminder. Of course, nothing beats a one on one with you, but you're going to get a chapter in here is really helpful. And, you know, you talk honestly about, you know, you being an entrepreneur, but for anyone who follows us like, Wow, so amazing. And you've accomplished so much. You started back at writing for a local paper. Yes. If you could walk us through kind of the steps of you know, your career journey started out writing for the local paper, then you joined with a partner.
Leisse Wilcox 5:45
Yeah, it was kind of a bizarre. I mean, it always is bizarre in hindsight, right. And I love studying people's biographies like really, really successful people's biographies. Because you can start to look at all those little pieces that didn't make any sense that felt random at the time, that totally were not random. And so for me, it was like I had this story, this narrative growing up that I couldn't write that I wasn't talented that nobody wanted to, like, these are the messages I actually received. Nobody wants to know what you have to say, Leisse. And so it was like, eventually, you hear that enough time, enough times and it chips away at you. And it's like, okay, so that must be true. So I had in my head, like I had nothing original to say I had no value at all. And again, looking back, I'm like, that's actually funny. It wasn't funny. At the time, it was so painful and overcoming it was so painful. But now it's like, I can't believe that was my reality, knowing who I become now, but it started when I you know, I had been a Montessori teacher. And I left my teaching career to raise a start and raise a family. I had three kids in two years, because I had a set of twins, like less than two years after my first baby was born. I was like, Okay, I'm not going back to work with other kids. With my kids. And as so many, I don't think we're like, you know, this is one of the things we're not allowed to talk about. But like, being at home with your kids is 100% a luxury like it is such a gift. And it absolutely is privileged to be able to do that. And there's a both and here, and it wasn't enough. I felt so underused, I was like over committed to running my family and running my house. And so undervalued because being a parent, particularly being a mother is mostly thankless work for most of the job, right. And so I was like, I need to do something else. And I found a call out to a local newspaper, accepting new columnists. And I started to take all of that information about education and child development and family dynamics. And I created a regular parenting column that I wanted people to read. So I turned it into a blog, and I wanted people to read the blog. So I learned how to use social media. And in learning how to use social media, I paired up with somebody like a friend of mine in town, who also loved Instagram. Before like, now, it's totally common to have social media managers five years ago that didn't exist. And if it did, it was totally about Facebook, and how to maximize Facebook exposure. Even Facebook ads weren't really a thing. Yeah, right. And that's like a five year window. Anyway, so we started basically working with small and medium sized entrepreneurs, mostly female owned and operated. And we were intending to hijack your Instagram feed and really just make it sing and copy and photos and brand messaging. And almost every single time in those meetings, somebody our client would turn to my partner and be like, Okay, so let's talk sales strategy, etc. And they would turn to me and they'd be like, I gotta be very honest with you. My husband thinks this is a joke. He thinks it's just a hobby, and I have to prove him wrong this time. Or, you know, I grew up feeling like my mother told me, I was never creative. And I really need to show her that I am and this is what I have to do. So I naturally started my own coaching practice. Again, kind of by accident, right? organically, it just came to me. And when you keep following those little cosmic breadcrumbs, those little bits of intuition, those little hits, and you do what really lights you up, that brings you passion that feels in line with your purpose, even if you don't know what that purpose is, or can articulate it, when it feels really good. And it brings you joy, and again, just feels like pleasurable and passionate, it's like, it's generally a good sign that you're doing the right thing. Then by following each of those little breadcrumbs. Eventually, I was able to go back and get further education over and over and over again and backed up my own coaching practices, tactically learned a lot more about the subconscious mind and how that works. And you know, dot, dot, dot, five years later, it's turned into this really beautiful little empire of genuinely serving women and I've been a really authentic way.
Molly Dare 9:45
And beautiful it is if you're not already following Leisse, please give her a follow up. You literally are a ray of sunshine. I get so excited when your stories pop up in my feed that I'm having. You do have A very beautiful gift of just knowing what to say how to say and how to refrain and show people how to refrain by doing it yourself, being authentic about it. And I think that's really a talent to be able to do that, and show that in an authentic way. You know, it's really powerful to watch watch happen, you did speak about your childhood and how you were feeling, you know, insecure about certain things. But I want to go back to your childhood, because you do speak a lot about this. And the trauma that you're that you are starting with your mother leaving you at a very young age.
Leisse Wilcox 10:34
That sucks. It's like, you know, it sucked. And 30 some years later, my mom and I, who had not had contacted in decades, we reconnected and you know, there was so much forgiveness work, there was so much acceptance that happened, that now we can have this kind of from a distance relationship that isn't necessarily close, it isn't necessarily like, you know, I learned how to grow up without a mother and how to like, kind of fill that role with other surrogate mothers around me. We don't have that kind of mother daughter relationship, but we can be in each other's lives and kind of a really peaceful and lovely way. But at the time, that was really difficult. It sounds wild to say this, but the harder part of that situation is that when my mom left, it was just my dad and I. And we had such an incredibly strong bond and relationship. And then my stepmother came into the picture. And that I think, that was like, what really started to break me down is that I had this very narcissistic, emotionally abusive stepmom, that was more painful and took a lot longer to heal than anything than anything else.
Molly Dare 11:41
Yes. And you refer to it as yours. That's when your Cinderella story, began it and reading through it. And you know, you go into more detail in the book about specific instances, it really wants a Cinderella story and unbelievable.
Leisse Wilcox 11:54
I didn't even observe that like in it. But on my wedding day, I remember several people from my then husband's family coming to me and being like, I feel like I'm watching Cinderella play out right now. And I started to like juxtapose the two stories. And it was like almost, it was almost like score for score the exact storyline.
Molly Dare 12:12
And ironically, because you're such an amazing, beautiful writer. She's the one that made you stop writing.
Leisse Wilcox 12:17
I know.
Molly Dare 12:18
For a while.
Leisse Wilcox 12:19
Yeah, I know. I know.
Molly Dare 12:21
I love that. And I love that you have a best selling book. There's nothing better than those moments I'll tell you that much.
Leisse Wilcox 12:29
And emotionally, that part doesn't even matter to me now. Like when I used to fantasize about writing this book, I would like part of the fantasy was like, Oh, this is gonna feel so good. I'm gonna write a big handwritten note and send it to my parents. Now, I don't care. I was like, I don't need I've healed so much that I don't even need that. It's just, it feels so good to be able to tell that story and something that I was so ashamed of, and carried in isolation for so long. Now, I got to a point where I felt comfortable talking about it. And it's like, when you get comfortable talking about it, there's no more stigma. There's no more shame. Honestly, there isn't any, like hatred or anger. There's none of that anymore. Because it was just like, Oh, this is just what happened. And looking back, I can tap into this place of compassionate forgiveness, and be so appreciative that, How's this for irony, the woman who told me I would never write that nobody ever wanted to read me. All of that stuff created such an incredible storyline in my own life that has shaped who I am today, which wouldn't have been possible unless I had that like crazy, painful upbringing, right? It's like, Oh, well played God. How did you do that?
Molly Dare 13:34
You talk about forgiveness in your book, and how important a lesson it is to forgive and you know, with the holidays, and everything and everything that we've been going through, and people have complex family situation all over because... How important, is it to forgive? And how can people come to terms with maybe a difficult family situation which you clearly did with your mother? What are some steps or advice you would give in finding forgiveness.
Leisse Wilcox 14:04
One of my favorite truths, one of my favorite sayings is that our feelings are just feedback. And that feedback is constantly giving us valuable insights as to what still needs to be healed. So for, you know, generations worth of people who have never actually been taught how to feel their feelings, and certainly have not been taught how to express their feelings that manifests for men and women very differently, like, but it's different kinds of repression. It's different kinds of don't feel this don't express this, when we actually pause and we allow ourselves the freedom and the permission to just feel our feelings. And we can kind of sit with that. We can start to trace back. What is this feeling I'm having and where is it coming from? And when you're clear on where it's coming from, that's the indicator of like, what still needs to be healed. For so many of us, it's things like, well, I'm the oldest and when my sister was born, all of a sudden, I felt like I had no attention. It's like, that sounds very trite. And when you're in those really formative malleable years, that is a traumatic event. And if it's not handled with grace and tenderness and love, it becomes its own self perpetuating story of like, well, I never get attention, or I have to do this in order to find attention, which means I have to do this in order to find love. And so suddenly, we have these snowballed stories that come from these really tiny, seemingly insignificant moments in our past, but they take on a life of their own. So as we're heading into the holidays, and we're thinking about forgiveness, and what does that mean, sometimes there's this tendency, and there's this like, parallel storyline that you either forgive, or you forget, which means you totally absolve the person if their actions and behavior or you just forget, it never happened. And I would argue, like don't do either of those things. Right? Like, forgiveness is not about setting the other person free or absolving them from behavior. It's setting yourself free. It's coming home to a new level of internal peace and harmony, that allows you to accept it as it is, right? And to look back and be like, okay, I can appreciate that, since we're all here having a human experience, that whatever happened, that person did the best they could at the time, was it the right thing? Maybe not, but it was probably the best they could at the time. How has it shaped me so far? And what will it do for me to be able to honor my own experience, and honor my own past and my feelings and everything that came out of that without the heavy and painful attachment to that person, because the alternative is to keep that person. So like, they did this to me like this happened to me, you have to feed that story, you have to keep that going. Because you have to stay attached to it in order to make that be a valid experience. So when you honor that experience, and you look at everything that has happened, and you can find a way of detaching from that story, and detaching from that pain, which is what I do with my clients all the time is learning how to detach from that pain at the subconscious level, then you can get yourself into a very comfortable and neurologically emotionally safe place where you're allowed to keep the lessons, you're allowed to keep the information and you're allowed to let go of and forgive everything else that happened around.
Molly Dare 17:18
Hmm, wow, you bring up an interesting point in the book where you said, children do not receive education on emotional wellbeing. And I never even thought about that. Amazing would it be if when it was happening to you, again, you were able to understand it or reframe it in a certain way. How it is crazy that we don't teach that or make that a priority.
Leisse Wilcox 17:41
It's almost like we actively discourage it, right? And this isn't like, this isn't a judgment. This is a statement of fact, and I've done it too, as a parent myself, that, you know, a kid falls off a bike, and we're like, I know, it's okay, you're gonna be fine. They're not fine. Like they just fell off their bike, and they're in a lot of pain. And we're very quick to make the situation better of like, no, you're fine. It's gonna be okay, do you want a bandaid? What can I do? How do I fix it. And again, I have done this, I'm not judging anybody for doing this, I was sharing birthday parties, girls get this a lot. It's like, I know, you don't like her. But she invited you to a party. So you have to go or she invited you. Now you have to go. It's like, the message is even if we don't want to acknowledge us the messages, what you think and feel actually is not as important as what somebody else thinks and feels. And that becomes this beast, right? So to be able to have some compassion for ourselves and where we're at, you know, it's very easy for us to spout things about self care. But this is self care, like getting very clear on what are your needs? And how are you going to get them met? Because even back up? How do you acknowledge that you have needs and that you are worthy of having them met, right? Not just catering to everybody else all the time. But that messaging starts in childhood. So not only do we not get an emotional education, we're kind of always taught to not even feel our feelings or the feelings that we're having are wrong by somebody else's standard and definition.
Molly Dare 19:02
Right? And that we're supposed to please others before ourselves. And you talk a lot about you know how you're a people pleaser, or you were.
Leisse Wilcox 19:09
I was.
Molly Dare 19:12
myself as well. For example, at your wedding at your own wedding. Yeah, how you had your wedding day You didn't even like but you put what you thought everyone else would like, and at your own wedding
Leisse Wilcox 19:28
it's like my favorite story to tell because again, now to me, I've released so much that I've healed so much like now it's hilarious. Like, I love food. I'm so into food and the culture and the planning. And like the only two things I cannot stand and I can't even like and I mean that I can't even have a bite of them are lamb and salmon. So naturally we served lamb and salmon at the wedding because I thought it would impress people. And you know, to me, it was like, oh, if I impress people, then they'll really respect me and really what that is like They'll really love me and include me and revere me right? And you know, you know, anybody who follows me knows, even in my Instagram bio, it's like, blah blah coach blah blah change it like doing all this cool stuff emotionally it's like and taco enthusiasts, right? Like, I love tacos. I have artwork in my house dedicated to tacos. There's like a key chain on my key ring. It's like I believe in tacos like it's out of control. Anywhere I travel, I make sure I go to a great taqueria. So I have this like, compendium of taco joints across the USA. It's like, it's a thing. Like, of course, we didn't serve those at the wedding. Of course, we served something that was totally outside of my realm, and it was a shit show. Because apparently, lamb and salmon do not buy you street cred. They repulse people. So instead of people like really tucking into this bougie food, ate all the salads, but then we ran out a salad. Because like, No, we didn't have enough food to feed anyone. And it was just like, in hindsight, it's just so funny. The lengths that we go to, that we think are, you know, we don't ever want the thing, we want the feeling we think that thing is gonna give us so by serving this like high end food at my wedding, I really thought it was going to earn me love. And what a great insight to have, oh, my God, there was something about me that felt I couldn't be loved or that love for me was conditional. And when you stop and sit in the emotional experiences, like where did that come from? And how do I heal that? Right?
Molly Dare 21:24
Absolutely. And not to jump right from the wedding to the divorce.
Leisse Wilcox 21:28
Just, just press the fast forward button.
Molly Dare 21:33
You had a great metaphor, when you spoke about your divorce, and you likened it to realizing there were cracks in the ceiling. I thought that was really powerful as someone who's gone through a divorce as well. That is how it started to feel he started to notice that first crack in the ceiling, you're like, Oh, we should repair that. Let's do that. Yeah, and I just thought that was a really beautiful way to describe the slow process of growing apart somewhat with the marriages where you just kind of grow apart and you're not growing together or kind of growing in the same way. But but there's the cracks start to show. Yeah, everything that you've been through, and we'll get to some of the other tough stuff, that it was the hardest of all the things but when you came through it, you felt the phoenix rising from the ashes.
Leisse Wilcox 22:18
Absolutely.
Molly Dare 22:19
I can relate to that because I can relate to that as well as difficult as it was to get through. When you come through something that dramatic and challenging. There's no way I can get through this and everything happening. When you survive something like that. You feel almost invincible. It's like this.
Leisse Wilcox 22:36
It's like every you have this new awareness that everything matters, and nothing matters, right? It's like this handful of things. But those are only the important things. And literally everything else does not matter because and I think it's such an important conversation to have to really normalize the conversation around divorce, like look at the statistics, one in two marriages end period. That is true across the US. It's true across Canada, which to me as somebody who is like almost 40, I'm looking at marriages, and I'm like, it's only half the marriages that end but that doesn't even delve into the like the metric of happiness of people who stay married, right? This is a conversation that people are terrified to have, because of the stigma because of the association because the immediate backlash if you have children is like, Oh my god, this is the worst possible thing you could ever do to your children. It's like, no, the worst possible thing you could ever do to your children is model an unhealthy, toxic, abusive, unfulfilling joyless relationship. That's far more detrimental than Divorce, Divorce is detrimental. I like for sure. There's a way of handling it. So the impact of it is minimized, right. But like staying together in a relationship in which you're teaching your kids, this is what love looks like. Sorry, not sorry, that's doing a far worse disservice to your children. And I am here to like poke holes in the illusion that that is valuable. And being true to yourself is not.
Molly Dare 24:05
Absolutely. And you know, divorce is not an ending. It's an ending of something that mattered. It was meaningful to you, but it's not the ending. And it's just the start of a new beginning. Yeah. And I think that can be beautiful in its own ways, obviously, not how you saw your life going but even if you say happily married things will happen in your life that are not how you planned it.
Leisse Wilcox 24:25
That is life
Molly Dare 24:27
Yes.
Leisse Wilcox 24:27
This was so long ago, but I remember you shared something on your Instagram and it's like a photo of you on the beach. And it's recounting that story of in that moment, and your face says it all but recounting that moment of like, I have no choice but to succeed. Now, it's that that really stoic poignant moment of like, Oh, shit, like, there's no plan B I am. So in this. This just has to work. I don't know that people can understand that unless you've really been in that position of like, I have no choice except up period.
Molly Dare 24:59
Absolutely. So let's go to another topic, which is your cancer diagnosis, and your emotions those first few weeks that you found out.
Leisse Wilcox 25:11
Again, more stigma more shame, right is that somebody who's, who's a sharer, like I'm a gatherer of information and a sharer, when I got this kind of, I say random, it lead spontaneous, I think it had a much deeper level of impact, but there was no family history. So it was kind of an out of the blue cancer diagnosis, it was breast cancer, when you get breast cancer, and you're 36 or 37, it tends to be highly aggressive on top of everything else. So it's like one of those moments of like, we got to get this out, like, immediately, it's gonna be an aggressive treatment. And in those first few weeks, I was like, Well, I guess it just won't tell anybody. And I don't know where it came from. But there was so much shame. And I think in hindsight, again, it's like, when you hear divorce, there's this baggage that comes with it, like, Oh, this is what divorce looks like, you have to participate in it for cancer is the same thing. It's like, oh, if you have cancer, here's what the next few years of your life are going to look and feel like and I was like, I don't want that. Therefore, I'm going to keep it to myself. I found a way. Same thing, as is like a very consistent theme in the movie of my life. I get overwhelmed, I lie on the floor, I start screaming. And then there's a download that's like, Oh, this is how you do it. Right? When I got cancer, I was like, How the hell am I gonna do this, and I got that little download again, that was like, you're gonna make this beautiful. I was like, I'm sorry, pardon me.
Molly Dare 26:31
In your book, where you, you said to the doctor, I can lose the doctor, the nurse, but you but I don't want to be a patient. I don't want to feel like a patient, you started using the word beautiful, and I'm going to make cancer beautiful. And you turn trauma into beauty.
Leisse Wilcox 26:46
Yes
Molly Dare 26:46
that is powerful. That is an amazing thing.
Leisse Wilcox 26:50
That just gave me the shivers. Still, when I hear that, because think about how powerful and how empowering that is, I tuned so much out about what the cancer experience was gonna look and feel like and I was like, No, this is what it's gonna be like for me. And because, you know, my communication is pretty good. And my boundary setting is now very good. It's like, I would be able to talk to my healthcare practitioners in a way that was loving and respectful. And also was very clearly communicative of this is what I need, like, I know you have your medical job to do, and I as the user, I need to have this way. So as an example, I knew and I have coined this emotional alchemy, right, that ability to turn something really dark and heavy and unwanted into something beautiful and uniquely your own. And so for me, it was like, well, man, I've been talking about writing a book for all this time, and I just keep never having enough time to do it. So how about I take this four months period of chemotherapy, and I use that each five hour session to write the book. And so to my nurses, I communicated that I was like, I'm gonna be here writing. So can I have that chair over there? Because I like the angle and I like the light. And this is Canadian healthcare. This is not like a two tiered system or anything. They were like, yes. And every day I went for treatment, they had the chair bloody reserved for me, like how special is that? Right?
Molly Dare 28:11
It was just little things like that, which a lot of time for you. What a difference they make in your just emotional well being.
Leisse Wilcox 28:19
Yes. Totally. And it was things like you know, I had a special uniform I would put on for chemo, I had like, just like one sweatshirt one sweat pants, or set a track pants with cool sneakers and like, bought this awesome Lululemon bag. I made it an event like and I made it kind of special. So that it wasn't I wouldn't call it chemo, I would call it detox. And I was like, Oh, I'm just detoxing my body. It's like this bougie treatment, I have to go and they like hook me up for like five hours. You know, I like I had to reframe it and recreate it for myself. Because then it became pleasurable. And I allowed myself and people like, I still see the looks on people's faces. And it's almost like a How dare you? Like, how dare you do that? And it's like, how dare I not do that for myself? Like how dare I not honor what I specifically needed. And when I found a way of making that experience, so uniquely my own. I'm not kidding, miracles came up all over the place, like things that shouldn't have happened, like happens all the time, because it became this beautiful co creative relationship in which I showed up differently. And I treated people differently. And they treated me differently as a result. And it was just like, it just became this really special and intimate experience in my life
Molly Dare 29:32
It is so amazing with everything that you've you've gone through that you have such positivity, you're definitely a positive thinker. I'm a very look at everything glass half full thinker. You talk about the paradox of positivity, that it can be both a curse and a blessing. And I totally understand that because it might mean Yeah, sometimes kind of through things and I thought that was a very interesting you know, part of owning that it is a double edged sword sometimes
Leisse Wilcox 30:02
it is. And I am so glad that you brought that up. Because I think there's, again, there's this tendency, there's this well informed or well intentioned narrative that's like, just be positive, like, find the good. And it's like, absolutely, like have this relentless enthusiasm and optimism, and allow yourself to be very honest with your feelings. Because if we're not feeling our feelings, and we're only choosing positivity all the time, it's just another form of repression. It's just another reach, like people reach to alcohol to numb the pain, they reach to positivity to numb the pain, like you have to be able to feel the fullest expression of your shadow of these dark, uncomfortable places. And when you feel into them, and allow yourself to sit with them, and observe them or question them, that's when you're able to like almost arrive at this genuinely positive place. Because you've had this like breadth of emotional experience and feeling everything and choosing the optimism, right, not ignoring everything else. But getting the whole like, it's like being at a buffet, you try a little bit of everything. And then you just have more of, let's say, the jello or whatever
Molly Dare 31:13
That part hit me hard. I feel like I'm just in the initial stages of learning how to feel my feelings, I have been a glass half full person for the majority of my life. And I realize that I've been doing that as a coping mechanism. It's not that I'm modeling this positive all the time at all, I have learned to have gratitude. And I think sometimes my positivity is really just, I'm just grateful, it doesn't mean that I'm being positive today, or that bad things didn't happen to me all day, I'm choosing to focus on the things that I'm grateful for today. You know, when you look at our social media, we highlight the positive, or I should say I do because you're very happy to get very real, but I, I really highlight the parts of my life, it doesn't mean I'm not suffering, it doesn't mean that there aren't negative, I just choose to focus on the stuff that I'm grateful for. However, I do realize that to feel whole, yeah, I have to accept the other feeling. And I'm just starting to work on that myself. And it's not always comfortable. You say at some point, you need to learn how to have a bad day in that, feel it
Leisse Wilcox 32:28
and not be destroyed by it.
Molly Dare 32:30
Right. And I think that and I'm sure you hear this all the time with your clients that I'm so afraid of being in that negative space and not knowing how to get back out of it. Because I'm so uncomfortable there.
Leisse Wilcox 32:43
Yeah. The irony is that it's only in feeling into that discomfort that allows you to listen to it. It's like, you know, when kids are little and they're having a tantrum and a tantrum and a tantrum, ignoring the tantrum doesn't usually work like it's happening for a reason. And our feelings are like that, too. So when something is trying to get your attention, and you ignore it, it goes away for a little while. And then it gets your attention in a louder way. And you can ignore it and repress it, and it goes away for a little while longer. And then eventually you can't ignore that message anymore, right? That feeling comes up or it manifests as cancer or it comes out in some other like physical way in your body. And then it's like, did I get your attention now? Okay, excellent. Here's what I have to say. So simply by being able to be like, Okay, this is what jealousy feels like and naming it or this is what like, this is what resentment feels like, we're Oh my god, loneliness. To say out loud, like, Oh, shit, I feel really lonely, is like everything in our body is like, no, you're not allowed to feel that like this is a failure. You're not allowed to do this. And in this, like, hyper social online world that we live in, it's like, no bad day is good vibes only. It's like, That's such a disservice. That's not reflective of the human experience. Right? to like, take a Buddhist approach. Life is suffering. So when you choose to see that suffering is just something that it just is like, it's not good. It's not bad. It just is. Then you you give yourself this hall pass to be able to feel loneliness, and joy, and gratitude and jealousy, because they're just feelings. That's it.
Molly Dare 34:18
Yeah, absolutely. One of my favorite topics, which is failure. I know that sounds weird, but
Leisse Wilcox 34:24
I love that.
Molly Dare 34:25
And you call it the art of failure. And I love that even more. My favorites, that I don't believe in failure, I don't feel that anything is is necessarily a failure. As long as you take the lessons learned from it, and help that bring you forward as long as you can allow that to happen, then it to me, it wasn't a failure. It's a learning experience. And you said that, you know, it kind of leads to jump to the fear of getting what you want.
Leisse Wilcox 34:53
Yes
Molly Dare 34:54
with failure. There's also another fear of actually getting what you want and being successful.
Leisse Wilcox 34:59
Yes.
Molly Dare 35:00
imposter syndrome.
Leisse Wilcox 35:01
Yes. This is one of my favorites to talk about, because it's like, oh, yeah, never getting so juicy with it right that, like, people think that it's crazy. And it's like, how could you be afraid of getting what you want? I'll tell you like, the clientele that I have. They're usually women, some men who were at like the top of their game, that they've gone through the checklist, they did everything, right. They went to the right school, they met the right people, they chose the right career, they're making the right amount of money, and they're making a great income. They have the kids or they chose not to have kids, like they've done everything, right. And then they get to this place of like, so how can this isn't feel like I thought I was gonna feel right. And it's like, there's so much subconscious work involved here. Because you get to this point of, what is it that I want? Like, what's the intention behind all of this that I just did? And what do I want? And if I, this starts to wear a couple of different hats, but one option is like, if I get what I want, like all this thing that I've been working to for my whole life, what does that actually say about me? And if there's a story from the past of like, oh, you're not lovable, you're not worthy. my subconscious, which is constantly sweeping the environment for signs of danger, is looking at any inkling of I might be loved, or I might be worthy. And interpreting it physiologically, in the same way would interpret like an intruder or a bear chasing you down. It's like, no, this isn't safe, because it conflicts with every other story of adopted in your life. So suddenly, like nothing is what it isn't anymore, right? It's, we want this thing so badly. And just as we get close to having it a lot of us start to self sabotage or that imposter syndrome starts to sink in. And it's tuning back into our own emotional experience that allows us to start to get clarity in Why am I actually feeling like this, and where did this come from, so that we can then confront what this fear is actually telling us. And it allows us to bust through that invisible ceiling, get to the other side, and then actually achieve the kind of success that we want, which is usually a lot more internal success than it is measurable.
Molly Dare 37:05
And you as important as it is to understand how to have a bad day. You also have a great exercise on envisioning your ideal day, how important that is to do and I really loved that. And I love that question of asking yourself that what your ideal day?
Me personally
Leisse Wilcox 37:21
yeah. Well, it's pretty low key, and it happens every other Saturday. my kids are not here. But, you know, just freedom is one of my core values, like freedom and fun, they go hand in hand for me. So like, the freedom to just wake up and take my time waking up, you know, having great coffee, going for a little road trip to explore a new town, you know, having like an amazing lunch, maybe having a nap or a bath, watching a great movie, spending so much time just laughing like, it's it's so simple. So many times people are like, my ideal day involves like a yacht and traveling around the world. And for some people it does. For most of us, it's the feeling of like, what aligns with my core values. How do I start to create that like little bit by little bit? If you really value freedom? How do you create more moments of freedom in your everyday life, so that it starts to feel more free. One of my clients, I did this with like every client, and one of them. This was a amazing example. In hers, it was like, I wake up, it's this beautiful condo, I have this like green smoothie, like, I'll go through all the things. I have this amazing Japanese incense that feels so luxurious to me. And it's such an indicator of how far I've come and I slipped into this Prada dress. And like we went through the whole exercise. And by the end of it, I was able to pull out little things of like, what can you actually do in your life right now, like right this very second. And she went on the internet, she found that like bougie Japanese incense, and use that as a ritual of holding that vision. So suddenly, she created like a 10 minute meditation window every day just sitting and like breathing in the smell of this incense, which to her represented everything in her life kind of coming true. And that's the instant shift, right? It's like, it's when we keep things far away from us. They seem unattainable. And we actually just break it down by going through like an ideal day exercise. You can pull out these little kernels of things that are actionable to do right now. that make you feel as if you're just one step closer. So for me on my I do it with my kids as well. But like, my ideal day is so simple that I just I because I'm so aware of all the things that bring fun and freedom and pleasure into my life and I'm just very conscious and mindful of doing them.
Molly Dare 39:43
Absolutely that word freedom really rang true for me. You're thinking of my ideal day and and you bring up that you did this drive down the Pacific Coast Highway as well. When I was envisioning what would be my dream day, you know, whatever it was when I drove From San Francisco down to LA and I drove up down the Pacific Coast Highway. And that feeling of freedom that I had, I was all by myself, and I'm just gonna take this drive, and I'm just gonna do it. I loved how I felt.
Leisse Wilcox 40:14
Isn't it amazing
Molly Dare 40:15
and I will do it, I can't drive down the Pacific Coast highway everyday or whatever. I do car rides, I do just take a road trip, whether it's 20 minutes, 30 minutes, it is how I clear my mind. And you know, I listen to my great music. And I'm just free for that. 20 minutes, 30 minutes an hour, however much time I have, I love getting in my car and just driving by myself.
Leisse Wilcox 40:41
Isn't it amazing? It's like, that's so simple. Like, what is simple pleasure. This is wonderful. There's so much attention being brought to meditation and really like why meditation is so important for our brain. That's meditative. Like when you're bringing that level of passion and joy and pleasure, while doing an activity that's kind of unconscious like that. It's just, it's, it does the same thing to your brain. And for your conscious mind, it just makes the entire life experience. So fun, right? Simply because you took 20 minutes in your day and just got in the car and went for a drive. It's so easy. And we become these victims of our own lives and circumstances. Like I could never do that. And like, oh, look what she can do. Like there's nothing, there's nothing that makes somebody more special or less special. It's that for a lot of us, it's that decision that I'm going to be very open about what my needs are what makes me feel good. And then I'm going to follow through and decide to do them, it might not be 24, seven, but maybe 20 minutes a day. And that's enough for now. Right?
Molly Dare 41:41
Yeah. And even in the first few weeks of lockdown back March, April, my daughters, and I would just go for a 20 Minute. For them You know, when we look back on this horrible year, there were some positives in it. And those moments, I'll always remember it again, simple road trip to know what we called them the road trips to nowhere. We laughed, we listen to music, and it was really either there's beauty in the simplistic sometimes, you have to have to remember that. You know, the title of your book is To Call Myself Beloved, and how important is that word beloved to you?
Leisse Wilcox 42:16
Very. It was like I think my only you can see it on video. But it's my second of like 23 tattoos, that there was this very short poem by Raymond Carver that I found at like, just the right moment in my life. And it's like four lines. I think it's a woman at the end of her life having a conversation with God. And the conversation is, did you get what you wanted in this life? I did. And what was it that you wanted to call myself Beloved, to feel myself Beloved, on the earth. And again, that like it just it just hit me, right? I found it at the exact right time, the exact right moment. And for me, that's what it is all about. It's this journey home to yourself that you can feel so beloved, simply by paying for being who you are. And that starts first with feeling that way about yourself. And the bonus is when you feel that emotional, neurological safety just to feel yourself beloved by others around you.
Molly Dare 43:16
I love that. So the final two questions that I like to ask my guests are, number one, what is your biggest regret?
Leisse Wilcox 43:25
I don't think you're gonna like this answer. I don't really have one. Like I've made mistakes, for sure. I really believe that if you can look at it through the right lens, there isn't really room for regret, are the things I would have done differently. I mean, consciously I want to say that one person that he thought it was a one night stand, I thought it was a relationship like maybe I would have handled that differently because of the emotional Fallout. But even so, in doing that I learned so much about myself and what I'm looking for in a relationship and what qualities he had that reflected back to me what like my ideal partner has so even that which is like the first thing that comes to mind, I'm like, I don't really regret it. You know, it hurt and it sucked. But I was able to pull so much information and so much growth out of it that I don't think it leaves a lot of room for regret.
Molly Dare 44:11
And what are you most proud of?
Leisse Wilcox 44:14
I think I'm most proud of myself. Like, that sounds so arrogant. But it's like, we evolve and we iterate through so many different versions of ourselves in our lives. And I'm 39 single three kids, I built this business and like I've come through cancer and divorce and abuse and it's just like, I love my life. Right? There are things that I still want to have that I don't have yet. And even finding peace in not having them right now. It's like I'm so proud of that. And I'm so proud to be the person that I am that I can share everything I've learned with my kids and totally rewrite that story of like, what parenting looks like right and what mothers look like and act like and how what kind of support they offer. And you know, the work that I do in the world is just it's so meaningful and fulfilling that I'm so proud of just being able to be that person.
Molly Dare 45:04
And for the listeners today who are inspired by you, where can they follow you? How can they contact you? What's the best way to reach you?
Leisse Wilcox 45:11
LeisseWilcox.com is the hub. That's my website. It's the hub. It has everything. I'm on Instagram every day @leissewilcox, I have I think 11 followers on Tiktok Also, please welcome. I'm like pretty all over the internet
Molly Dare 45:29
The tik tok journey and I feel like to tik tok and I are not getting along.
Leisse Wilcox 45:34
And Instagram always userps, every other technology. So just as I learned how to use tik tok, I was like, Oh, I could just make a reel like, I'm already here. So really on my website and Instagram are the best ways to get a hold of me. It just occurred to me I actually do have one life regret that I want to share with you because it's a big deal. When I was in high school, I worked at McDonald's, and I was employee of the month when I was 16. As a gift, like as a prize I got this big mac watch as like Employee of the Month watch. And it had like an actual Big Mac. That was the second hand. And I stupidly gave that away and that actually is a regret. I just learned a lesson. I wish I had that damn watch.
Molly Dare 46:22
That's a First
Leisse Wilcox 46:23
and hand to God it is true.
Molly Dare 46:27
Thank you so much for joining me today you are a ray of sunshine. Please everybody follow her and to everyone who is listening. Thank you so much for tuning in. And see you next episode with another powerful story of bravery and overcoming.
Thank you so much for listening to this episode of On Air with Molly Dare, you're supporting everything to me and to the guests who are sharing their personal story. The best way to support this podcast series is with a five star rating on iTunes. Writing a quick written review, give me all the feels and I read every single one and it means so much. If you screenshot your review and send it to us, you will be entered into our monthly giveaway and who doesn't love free stuff. The best way for this podcast to grow is by word of mouth and I would love for you to tell a friend share on social media. tag me in your stories if there's an episode or guests that really hits home for you that you're interested in learning more about what I do or want to receive my Mondays with Molly video series with insights on each episode and my personal takeaways head to mollydare.com. And you could sign up there. See you next episode and in the meanwhile, do something daring this week.
